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Speaker 1

00:00

-♪ ♪ -♪ ♪ Well, there's been spring break season. Our main story tonight concerns vacations. A wonderful time to realize that you're in love with someone, or realize that you are absolutely not. And be honest, you knew in the TSA line before the flight.

Speaker 1

00:18

Keep the streaming passwords for as long as you can, but do give back his grandmother's ring. Specifically, we're gonna talk about timeshares. And some of you might be thinking, hold on, are you gonna tell me that they are a scam? Because Surely everybody knows that.

Speaker 1

00:31

And it is true that the sketchiness of timeshare vacations has been a punchline on TV for years.

Speaker 2

00:37

You moron, these aren't free vacations. These are timesharing deals. They're total scams.

Speaker 3

00:42

These timeshare people, they don't stop until they sell you something. They... They prey on the weak and gullible, i.e.

Speaker 3

00:48

You.

Speaker 4

00:49

Perhaps you and your yellow friend would like to set up a timeshare plan?

Speaker 5

00:54

Don't do it, Sandy! I won't give in to your timeshare vacation scam!

Speaker 1

00:58

Yeah, suspicions about timeshare programs are so ubiquitous, they can get laughs in children's programming. And look, obviously, SpongeBob was never going to say yes to a timeshare, otherwise they'd have had to change his theme song to

Speaker 6

01:11

this. ♪ Oh...

Speaker 1

01:15

♪

Speaker 2

01:15

Who lives in a pineapple under the sea ♪ Except for 1 week a year when he's in a studio ♪ And he asks... 1, 5, staircase!

Speaker 1

01:22

Yeah, it's still good, but doesn't quite have the same ring to it, does it? But despite decades of mockery on TV, timeshares are a much bigger business than you may think. They're actually an 8.1 billion dollar industry, with nearly 10 million households owning 1 or more types of timeshare.

Speaker 1

01:38

And they can be sold by big hotel chains like Hyatt and Marriott, as well as companies like Wyndham and Westgate Resorts. But 1 of the things that may have obscured their continued growth is that they're not always called timeshares now. In recent years, they've been rebranded as vacation clubs or vacation ownership plans. And while traditionally you'd buy a timeshare that consisted of 1 week every year at, say, a condo in Florida.

Speaker 1

02:02

Nowadays, companies offer floating weeks that can theoretically be used anytime throughout the year, or timeshare points, where you buy points that you can redeem in a number of resort properties owned by the same company. But whatever you call timeshares, The people selling them maintain that they are not just excellent value, they are actively good for you. Here is a vice president at Westgate firing up his sales team in the weirdest possible way.

Speaker 2

02:27

Why are we here? To

Speaker 6

02:29

save lives!

Speaker 2

02:30

To save lives! Those who take the fewest amount of vacations are most likely to have a heart attack. You're just like a doctor, nurse, fireman, policeman, a lifeguard.

Speaker 2

02:46

They all save lives, and you all do it, too.

Speaker 1

02:49

You're right. Timeshare salespeople save lives just like doctors and nurses. That is why, during the initial outbreak of the pandemic, we New Yorkers would loudly cheer for all the Timeshare salespeople as they came back from work.

Speaker 1

03:03

We do that at 6 p.m. And then if we still had some energy left, we'd throw a few claps to hospital workers at 7 for whatever they were doing. But the fact is, Timeshares don't save lives. In fact, in many cases, they can Fuck them up.

Speaker 1

03:16

Because they are incredibly easy to get into, but as you will see, incredibly hard to get out of. So tonight, let's talk about timeshares. And let's start with the first thing that you probably already know about them, that they tend to be sold in person, aggressively, and while you're already on vacation, often by suckering people into agonizingly long sales presentations with the promise of a free gift. There are so many horror stories out there, like the woman whose parents were subjected to a seven-hour sales pitch that ended with them spending more than $10, 000 on a timeshare, or the person who signed an agreement following a five-hour presentation because, quote, -"I'm a diabetic.

Speaker 1

03:52

After 5 hours, I just gave in. I needed something to eat." And I do get that. Listen to a timeshare presentation is dead last on the list of things that I want to do for 5 straight hours, right after watching Avatar The Way of Water, telling children that their pet hamster was eaten by their other pet hamster, and that neither 1 ever knew the child in question existed. And of course, hearing other people talk about watching Avatar The Way of Water.

Speaker 1

04:19

The problem is, though, once you are in that room, companies can go to extreme lengths to get you to commit on the spot. Just watch as that Westgate executive encourages his staff to stop at nothing to make a sale.

Speaker 2

04:32

Our number 1 person in Orlando owns several weeks of timeshare. You know, you should own at least 1 week yourselves. And if you don't, lie and say you do!

Speaker 1

04:42

-♪

Speaker 6

04:42

I'm a man of my word ♪ -♪ I'm

Speaker 2

04:42

a man of my word ♪ Don't let these people leave here without buying something. Something.

Speaker 1

04:50

I don't know what is more alarming there, that he knew a camera crew was filming and still instructed his sales team to lie, or that he knew that and willingly wore that shirt, because what the fuck is that thing? It looked like someone ate a Persian rug and then threw up on it. He looks like the mascot for divorce.

Speaker 1

05:10

Lying is actually a key strategy for many timeshare salespeople. They will lie about everything from the ease of making reservations to the total cost of the timeshare. According to a lawsuit against Wyndham, salespeople even had an acronym, TAFT, which stood for, Tell Them Any Frigging Thing. And come on, at this point, just say fucking, because it's 1 thing to lie, it's another to do that while talking like a middle schooler who's in the car with their mom but still trying to sound hard.

Speaker 1

05:39

But the thing is, lying is basically allowed in this industry. Many timeshare agreements contain a clause that absolves the developer from responsibility for anything sale reps say. It's often referred to by attorneys as the Salesman's License to Lie Clause. And look, I get that sales reps bullshit customers constantly.

Speaker 1

05:59

It happens to me Every time a Wabi Parker employee tells me, -"You look so cool." -$50, 000. But you wouldn't expect them to be able to lie about something as objective as how much a thing will cost. Now, the good news is, depending on where you made your purchase, you can have between 3 and 10 days to rescind your signature. But, remember, a lot of people sign up for timeshares on vacation.

Speaker 1

06:22

So that time may expire before they get home or have a chance to have a lawyer look at the contract. And this would be less of an issue if people generally loved their timeshares. But a study found that 85 percent of timeshare owners regret their purchase. Which is a rate of regret on par with people who bought teacup pigs, only to realize that teacup pigs don't really exist.

Speaker 1

06:44

What do exist are baby pigs that grow into a 90-pound piece of livestock that can suffocate your cat. And at this point, let's talk about why people might regret buying a timeshare. And the first major reason, unsurprisingly, is cost. Because the upfront cost for a one-week annual timeshare vacation can average around $24, 000.

Speaker 1

07:06

But that is just the beginning. Because on top of that come other expenses like maintenance fees, which typically go up every year, and at high-value resorts can run from $2, 500 to $3, 500 per year. And you are on the hook for those costs whether you use your timeshare or not. Which actually brings us to another major problem, because if what you bought is points or a floating week plan, You still need to book time at your resort, which can be unexpectedly hard.

Speaker 1

07:35

Just listen to this man explain his attempts to book a vacation at the Westgate Timeshare that he bought in Branson, Missouri, 6 years earlier.

Speaker 7

07:44

The first year...

Speaker 4

07:45

I call a month in advance. They say, you're calling, you're giving us a very short notice.

Speaker 7

07:51

So year 2, they called 6 months in advance.

Speaker 4

07:53

You're calling too early.

Speaker 7

07:55

Year 3, they called 2 months in advance, but we're told they called too late.

Speaker 4

07:59

And you can still go, but we have to charge you like any other person.

Speaker 7

08:04

So far, the Nasirs have spent more than $15, 000 for a timeshare they've never spent a single night in. When the Nasirs complained to Westgate, they were told they would have an easier time using their timeshare if they upgraded to a better plan for an additional

Speaker 1

08:20

$15, 000. Yeah, that's not great, is it? Being asked to pay $15, 000 for something that you've only seen in pictures is not a timeshare.

Speaker 1

08:30

That's an expensive and remarkably niche OnlyFans account. -♪ ♪ -♪ ♪ But Westgate's response is pretty common across the industry. Once you buy a timeshare, the pitch is, you really need to upgrade to get the most, or possibly anything, out of your purchase. And these upgrades are a fundamental part of the business model.

Speaker 1

08:49

At 1 investment conference, Marriott stated that every $30, 000 spent on the purchase of a new timeshare should generate an extra $20, 000 from upgrades after just 5 years. So it's hardly surprising that companies frequently pressure people to pay for upgrades, sometimes with the exact same aggressive tactics that got them to buy the timeshare in the first place. Customers of Wyndham Resorts have said that whenever they'd go on vacation, They'd be forced into so-called owner update meetings, where they were then pressured to spend more, like this woman.

Speaker 8

09:21

The 76-year-old widow is deep in debt, owing more than

Speaker 1

09:25

$175, 000,

Speaker 8

09:27

after she claims she was repeatedly tricked and harassed into buying timeshare points. Folds also claims in her lawsuit, Wyndham sales reps told her things to convince her to buy more points that ended up not being true.

Speaker 4

09:37

If I would just sign it, then they could lower the interest rates.

Speaker 8

09:42

Is that, in fact, what happened?

Speaker 4

09:43

No.

Speaker 8

09:45

No. She says Wyndham salespeople also told her the company would buy back any extra points she didn't use. And that, too, she later found wasn't exactly as it had been explained. Were you surprised to discover that?

Speaker 4

09:57

Very surprised. Not only surprised, He may need to bleep this out. I was mad as

Speaker 6

10:04

hell. Wow!

Speaker 1

10:06

She is pissed there. I know mad as hell might not sound that extreme to us delinquents on HBO, but coming from a 76-year-old woman in Tennessee, that's equivalent of a child screaming mother fucker through a bullhorn at an elementary school. It's that level of intensity.

Speaker 1

10:23

So between fees and the constant pressure to pay for upgrades, you can see how people might end up regretting their purchase. Even those who initially enjoyed their timeshare might end up wanting to get rid of it, either because they're getting older and not wanting to travel as much, or they're just getting tired of going to the same place. But the problem is, whatever your reason for wanting to leave a timeshare, you will soon realize it is very hard to do that. And that is because many agreements contain a so-called perpetuity clause.

Speaker 1

10:52

That means that the purchase, as well as all those regular maintenance fees, are a non-cancellable lifetime obligation. Which is ridiculous. A contract for a vacation shouldn't be harder to get out of than fucking Scientology. Where's Shelly, by the way?

Speaker 1

11:08

I'm sure she's fine, but where is Shelly? Now, some developers claim to have programs where they'll take a timeshare back, but there is a lot of fine print there, including the fact that they're often only available at the developer's discretion, and could involve paying a significant fee, which sometimes can be equivalent to 2 years of maintenance fees. And if the company won't take it back, Good luck. Because it can be hard, if not impossible, to sell a timeshare.

Speaker 1

11:34

In fact, the resale site Red Week shows a number of them being sold for literally 0 dollars. And keep that in mind anytime anyone says that a timeshare is an investment. Investments are supposed to gain value. A timeshare is as sound an investment as opening a Ghislaine Maxwell-themed restaurant.

Speaker 1

11:54

Ghislies! When you're here, you're in danger. -♪ Ghislies! ♪ -♪ Ghislies!

Speaker 1

11:58

♪ And all this actually gets 1 step worse, thanks to something that's often framed as a selling point for timeshares.

Speaker 9

12:05

It's a great feeling to know that our grandchildren, when we're not around, will be enjoying it.

Speaker 4

12:11

It will

Speaker 9

12:11

be our legacy to them.

Speaker 10

12:13

Even as we pass on, it's something that we can continue to give to our children. It's a gift that we'll keep on giving beyond us.

Speaker 11

12:20

Now that we have 2 children, it's kind of exciting that we know that our credits will never go to waste. It will still be in our family through our boys.

Speaker 1

12:30

Okay, 1 of those boys seems happy about that, but the other 1 does seem pissed, and much more interested in the upside-down construction truck that he's holding. And he's honestly right, because if there's 1 thing to take away from this episode, it's that if you have a choice between a timeshare and an upside-down truck, take the truck every time. At least you technically own that.

Speaker 1

12:50

But given everything that you've seen so far, you won't be surprised to hear that many people aren't super keen on inheriting a timeshare. And while you can technically decline it, that can be much, much harder to do than you might think.

Speaker 12

13:03

Walking away does take work. Namely, you must file a disclaimer of interest with the court saying that you reject the timeshare. You only have 9 months after the death of your loved 1 to file it.

Speaker 12

13:15

And even then it's not that simple. You see, when the first person in line rejects the timeshare, it goes to the next in line, and then the next, and the next. Every single person has to file all of that paperwork.

Speaker 1

13:26

It's true. Every single person. And Timeshare paperwork clearly isn't what grieving families need.

Speaker 1

13:34

It is pretty upsetting to think that there might genuinely be a market for sympathy cards that say, I'm sorry for your loss, but also move fast if you don't want to get stuck with the fees on your dead mom's Hilton Head 2 bedroom. And all of this brings us to what might be the most surprising thing here. Timeshares are so difficult to get rid of, a whole separate industry has now cropped up, known as the Timeshare exit industry. You may have seen ads on TV for them, or upbeat segments on local stations like these for a company called Timeshare Termination Team, where they can get a pretty strong endorsement.

Speaker 13

14:06

Colorado's local Timeshare Termination Team has a 100% success rate. Joining us, trusted advisors Brian and Holly Wilbur, with the first steps

Speaker 14

14:15

you need to take to legally get out of your timeshare. I'll be honest, I know I said this before, too. I didn't think this was possible, but it actually is.

Speaker 1

14:23

Now, that sounds pretty great, doesn't it? The basic pitch of exit companies is, for an upfront fee, they'll either resell your timeshare or get you out of your contract. And given how critical they are of the timeshare industry, you might assume that they are the good guys in this story.

Speaker 1

14:37

Unfortunately, they are very much not. Which you probably already suspected after that woman claimed a 100% success rate. Because that's 1 of those phrases that's just an automatic red flag. Like, endorsed by Dr.

Speaker 1

14:50

Oz, or Forbes cover model. It just immediately raises suspicions. Also, you should know, while that sure looks like the news, crucially, it and all those shows you just saw, are sponsored content programs. We did a story on them a couple of years ago, and it's where local stations will allow you to buy your way into fake segments that look like news, but are, in fact, ads.

Speaker 1

15:14

We actually bought our way onto that exact show on Denver 7 to sell a Nazi fuck blanket. And if you missed that story, go back and watch the whole thing, because that was 1 hell of a sentence that's missing about 21 minutes of context. Anyway, as it turns out, Timeshare termination team was even sketchier than our Third Reich fuck fleas, because not long after that, Denver 7's actual news team had this story to report.

Speaker 15

15:41

Debbie hired the company in June 2019. In all, she paid more than

Speaker 1

15:45

$14, 000.

Speaker 16

15:47

Signed a contract, a 2 year contract that ended this last June. Well, under the terms of the contract, if they don't resolve my issue, I can get a refund.

Speaker 15

15:57

2 years came and went. That's when she went looking for answers.

Speaker 16

16:01

So I came to... Came to see them, and it's empty.

Speaker 15

16:05

The signs are still up on this office in Greenwood Village.

Speaker 1

16:07

-♪ ♪ -♪

Speaker 15

16:09

But there's no employees. The furniture is gone.

Speaker 1

16:13

Wow. First, I'm not sure it was totally necessary to force her to go back and knock on the glass of a clearly empty office. But I'm very glad that they did. But second, that is a 19th century snake oil salesman level scam.

Speaker 1

16:25

They just disappeared. 1 moment they were there, the next, they were suddenly gone with no warning. Like a ghost or a TV show on HBO Max. -♪ ♪ -♪ ♪ Everything's fine at this company.

Speaker 1

16:36

Everything's fine. -♪ ♪ -♪ ♪ And unfortunately, that is by no means a one-off. As 1 consumer advocate puts it, I don't like generalizations, so I'll say that 99% of them don't do what they say they will, or worse, are out-and-out scams. But you know what?

Speaker 1

16:53

I do like generalizations, so I'm happy to say, timeshare exit companies are total bullshit. A lot of follow the same basic pattern that you just saw. They'll charge an upfront fee, and then either stall indefinitely or fully disappear. And they are taking advantage of people on a massive scale.

Speaker 1

17:10

In Missouri, 1 group of companies stands accused of deceiving consumers into paying more than $90 million for exit services that were not delivered. And while that case is still pending, all of these other companies have gone under in recent years. And I know that these exit companies might seem immediately suspicious to you now, but they have slick marketing, and have also been endorsed by some supposedly financially savvy people. In fact, Dave Ramsey, the popular personal finance guru, who to his credit, has been a vocal critic of timeshares, actually gave 1 exit company a ringing endorsement.

Speaker 1

17:44

Timeshare

Speaker 17

17:45

exit team will get you out of their timeshare. Now, you're gonna pay them money to do that, that's what they do. And they charge you up front, and they give you your money back guarantee if they don't get you out, but they'll get you out.

Speaker 1

17:56

Well, that sounds trustworthy, doesn't it? And after all, why wouldn't you take the word of a man whose look and general vibe answers the question, what if Billy Joel and Dr. Phil had a kid and it sucked?

Speaker 1

18:06

But... But not long after that, the Washington State AG sued Timeshare exit team, claiming, among other things, that the majority of its customers either did not receive their promised exit, received 1 that caused them unanticipated negative financial or other consequences, or received an exit that the customer could have obtained for themselves. The company eventually shut down, but only after it was forced to pay 2.6 million dollars in restitution. And if you're thinking any of that gave Dave Ramsey pause for reflection, you should know it did not.

Speaker 1

18:37

Because after Inside Edition did a segment covering Timeshare exit team's issues and questioning his endorsement of them, he pushed back like this.

Speaker 17

18:46

I didn't know you could buy a story on Inside Edition. I didn't think you all were that... I knew you were tabloid, but I didn't know you were that low.

Speaker 17

18:53

Or are you just so dumb that you didn't understand you were on the wrong side of this argument on the basis of the consumer? So this is why Timeshare's not on the air anymore, Timeshare Exit Team. But guess who's still on the air? Me.

Speaker 17

19:10

Me. And I'm sitting... In a $300 million paid-for building. Neck deep in cash, you jerks.

Speaker 1

19:22

Yeah. That is champion of the working people, Dave Ramsey, bragging about being neck deep in cash to his own viewers who got caught up in a scam that he actively promoted, all while having his hands like this. A pose used almost exclusively by cartoon super villains plotting ways to kill Batman. But the thing is, there is no right side to be on here.

Speaker 1

19:45

Timeshare companies and Timeshare exit companies are both terrible. 1 is a shitty business model that's somehow technically legal, and the other is oftentimes an out-and-out scam. But neither is good. And it's very important not to lose sight of the fact that beneath all of this are people who can get victimized, and in some cases, twice.

Speaker 1

20:04

If you watch a lot of stories about these companies, it is heartbreaking just how often the people in them talk about how ashamed they feel about falling for this.

Speaker 4

20:13

Nobody in my family knows. Nobody.

Speaker 17

20:15

Makes you feel bad when you think you've done something that's stupid.

Speaker 9

20:18

We bought the timeshare, which took us to the cleaners, and it just made me feel stupid.

Speaker 11

20:24

Doesn't make me too good. You know, it's like... I think I'm smarter than that.

Speaker 1

20:28

Yeah, I get that, but to be clear, the shame here should not be on the people who were duped. It should be on the industries that exploited them, told them any frigging thing they wanted to, and abused their understandable desire just to take a fucking break. So, what can we do here?

Speaker 1

20:44

Well, on the off chance that anyone watching right now is considering a timeshare, don't do it. If you know someone considering it, send them this segment. If you happen to inherit a timeshare, get rid of it as fast as possible. And if it's too late, and you're stuck with it, you can try and give it away for 0 dollars online, but the truth is, you'll only be fucking someone else over then.

Speaker 1

21:08

Unfortunately, the best option might actually be to call the timeshare company and see if there is any chance that they will take it back from you. As for exit companies, as you have seen, there's been sporadic legal action against individual companies. But by and large, it is a whack-a-mole ecosystem. When 1 goes down, another 1 tends to pop right up.

Speaker 1

21:27

So the truth is, the best bet right now seems to be to make sure that we all warn each other about just how fucked up this whole industry is. Or, I suppose, we could go another way with it. And if you can't beat them, join them. So, joining me now for a special sponsored segment that she may or may not have paid $3, 000 for, please welcome back to the show my lovely wife, Wanda Jo Oliver!

Speaker 1

21:51

-♪ ♪ -♪

Speaker 6

21:52

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE ♪ -♪ ♪ -♪ CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

Speaker 1

21:53

♪ -♪ ♪ -♪

Speaker 6

21:55

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE ♪ -♪ ♪ -♪ CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

Speaker 1

21:57

♪ -♪ ♪ -♪

Speaker 6

22:00

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

Speaker 1

22:00

♪ Hello there, Mwanda.

Speaker 5

22:02

Hello there, M'John!

Speaker 1

22:04

Now, Wanda, I understand you have a new Timeshare product that you'd like to share with us.

Speaker 5

22:09

That's right. I'm here to introduce my new company, Timeshare Exit Squared. Yes, the world's first ever timeshare exit company, exit company.

Speaker 5

22:19

Wow.

Speaker 1

22:20

Fascinating, Wanda. What does timeshare exit squared do exactly?

Speaker 5

22:24

Well, let's say you're stuck in a timeshare and you go to an exit company to get you out of the contract, but, uh-oh, that company just took all your money and disappeared without doing a dang thing. Well, Timeshare Exit Square can free you from your Timeshare Exit company and get all your money back.

Speaker 1

22:42

Wow, that is amazing, Wanda. You are truly saving lives, just like doctors, nurses, and firefighters. You are.

Speaker 2

22:52

You are. You are.

Speaker 1

22:54

You are, Wanda.

Speaker 5

22:56

I am way better than all them. All those people are scum compared to me. I spit on them!

Speaker 1

23:03

You spit? Wow. As you should, Mwanda.

Speaker 1

23:07

Now, tell me, how exactly does Timeshare Exit Squared work? How does it work?

Speaker 5

23:12

Well, it couldn't be easier, Mahjong. Mm-hmm. Simply pay us a quick and easy upfront fee of

Speaker 1

23:19

$20, 000,

Speaker 5

23:21

and within 3 to 58 business months... ..Your Timeshare Exit company will deposit a full refund to your bank account.

Speaker 1

23:35

Wow, Wanda, is that guaranteed?

Speaker 5

23:37

Oh, it's even better than a guarantee. It's a pinky swear promise.

Speaker 1

23:42

Ooh, I like it. I like that.

Speaker 5

23:44

That's why TomShare Exit Squared has over 9.3 billion happy customers and a 200% satisfaction rate. A 200% you said? That's right, for every TomShare Exit Squared customer, Another random person is also left satisfied.

Speaker 5

24:03

Wow!

Speaker 1

24:04

Wanda, that is incredible. I'll be honest, I didn't think this was possible, but it actually is!

Speaker 5

24:11

It sure is, depending on your definition of possible.

Speaker 1

24:14

Sure, Sure, that's fair.

Speaker 5

24:15

And if you run into any problems or delays, just call our hotline at 1-800-FLOWERS.

Speaker 1

24:20

Oh, nice. Nice. Yeah.

Speaker 5

24:24

Or come to the Timeshare Exit Squared offices.

Speaker 1

24:27

And you know what? How would someone do that, Mwanda?

Speaker 5

24:30

Well, all you have to do is drive up next to the Timeshare exit squared van and scream your 27-digit case number. And we'll be happy to help with anything you need until we cross the border into Nogales, Mexico.

Speaker 1

24:45

That sounds very reasonable, but people should act fast, shouldn't they, Mwanda?

Speaker 5

24:49

That's right, M'John. This particular company is only going to exist for the next 3 days. Right.

Speaker 5

24:56

Right. Then we're shutting it down and starting a new 1 in the Cayman Islands. Have you ever been? I haven't.

Speaker 5

25:01

I haven't. Well, I could sell you 1 week a year for just

Speaker 1

25:04

$50, 000.

Speaker 6

25:05

Oh, I

Speaker 1

25:05

like it.

Speaker 5

25:06

And nobody leaves here without buying something. Something.

Speaker 1

25:11

She's right. Thank you so much, Mawanda. That's our show.

Speaker 6

25:18

Thank you