Taken from JRE #1956 w/Luke Combs:
https://open.spotify.com/episode/4r9FA3jkGHbe7RvWZ3zCw3?si=16fb85601b5b4506

But I remember, and I think in my mind, is undeniably the GOAT, as again, a just above casual fan, Jon Jones.

There was all this debate until he submitted Cirogan and became the heavyweight champion.

Smashed him bro And Cyril looked kind of unbeatable up until the Francis fight

Well, the Francis fight exposed 1 aspect of his game that you're never gonna beat John in and that's the wrestling Yeah, and then everybody said well, he didn't know that Francis was gonna wrestle him given Francis is not the caliber wrestler or even in the realm of John Jones John Jones been wrestling since he was 12 years old.

He took down Daniel Cormier who's an Olympic level wrestler Yeah, there is not a guy in the world that can say that You could start wrestling at 29 years old I mean I mean you'd have to be the freakiest of freak athletes to be able to compete with that guy to start wrestling when Cyril Gawn started wrestling.

So I think what I was thinking is, and when I bring up Jon Jones, is I remember...

The first Jon Jones fight I watched was when he got DQ'd against Matt Hamill.

The next thing I feel like I remember, and I may have seen some of his fights in between then, but is when he like beat up this guy that was like trying to rob this lady like the night of

that was the day he fought for the title right he like a he fought for the title he chased down a guy who robbed someone And tackled him and held him until the cops came

and then and when I fought Shogun It became the youngest ever UFC champion.

Yep, so here's what I'm getting at is I room and I and this is gonna be an just Kind of I'm interested in your take on this because I watched it happen with Jon Jones, and I feel like I watched it happen with Kamaru as well.

Where it was like, Jon and Kamaru, as they came up, right?

It's like, Jon does this thing where he stops this robber and he wins the belt.

He beats Shogun, who is this kind of like...

You know, him and Lyoto were these kind of like Unfigurable guys to me as a fan at that time, right like guys like how do you beat Lyoto Machida?

You can't forget you can't even touch the guy right at that time and they were like inherently these like good guys that everybody was rooting for

then both of them became these like epically long-reigned champions that then became sort of like villains.

To me as a fan, again, who doesn't know anything, and maybe it's the, it comes back to maybe the celebrity, like, ego thing, like, to the camera as a fan.

Again, I've never met the guy, he's probably great.

But just as a cas watcher, I went from going, I'm rooting for this guy, to then it'd be like the way he talks about himself.

And I feel like Jon Jones was the same way to me.

Is they became this like really like, and then John got in all this kind of like turmoil-y stuff.

Well, I don't think you can compare the 2.

Like, have you ever seen Kamaru on my podcast?

He's 1 of the nicest, most down-to-earth, friendly, smiley, fun guys.

There's what you're seeing is Kamaru the destroyer

difference and that's what I was trying to ask is like signaling to all the other people I'm going to smash you

And that's what I think I was asking is like is that all just perceived by me or is that?

you know deciding what you like and what you don't like and personalities that you root for and Personalities you root against and sometimes you root against a guy and he wins you over because he's so goddamn good You like I wanted that motherfucker to lose but he's the fucking greatest Yeah, John is very different than Kamau John is what I would describe, there's human beings that have different temperament and different minds and different mentality and a Ruthless competitive drive that's almost terrifying to the ordinary person.

That's John Jones John Jones is a bad guy Who's trying to be a good guy?

Right, but that got that guy if we were living a thousand years ago he would be on a horse with the biggest battle axe, waiting in the back, hacking heads off, and everybody would be running.

But John is like a genuinely sensitive, intelligent guy who's trying to do the right thing, but he's a fucking conqueror He's a fucking conqueror.

That's that's that's the thing that's inside of him that leads him to be the goat and without that You don't get there.

You don't if you're you don't get that you don't get a Mike Tyson without that You don't get a Muhammad Ali without that.

You don't get a Marvin Hagler without that You don't get a you don't get that that there's a thing inside Some People that is a driving force that allows them to overcome the greatest around them.

It's a Michael Jordan It's a there's a there's a thing man

and those motherfuckers are hated They're always hated for sure because you have to hate him because you can't beat him.

It's the 260 inch deer dude Because my me and my buddies were talking.

It's like there's not like they're like man.

That's not the deer of a lifetime, that's the deer of 10 lifetimes.

But it's even more than that because you can just accidentally stumble across the deer of a lifetime.

Yeah Khabib is in the conversation But Mighty Mouse is in that conversation to Mighty Mouse to me if you want to look at like a technical expression of the greatness Of martial arts he's as good as anybody's ever done it when when Mighty Mouse was the flyweight champion and the only problem is up besides So who do and a couple other guys like Benavides and he was not dealing with guys that are of the caliber Of the guys that John Jones was facing John Jones was facing Gustaf Guss have sent Glover to share He was facing Daniel Cormier He was facing the elite of the elite, and he never fucking lost, even when he was doing coke and he wasn't even training.

And when Jon Jones talks about fights, though, when I had him on the podcast, 1 of the things that he talked about some people don't really watch tape or they only watch a little bit They let their coaches do the work John Jones studies everyone.

He studies their tendencies He's get it He gets in his mind how when you throw that Left kick you did you make this little step with your right foot You might do this thing when you shoot for a takedown when you keep your leg on You keep your head on 1 side every time you might do this thing Well when someone throws a right hand you always lean to The left you might do it and John Jones picked up that tendency and that's how he knocked out Daniel Cormier he knew Daniel Cormier has a tendency to duck towards his right side because he goes for that single on the left leg and John caught him with a perfect head kick But It wasn't by an accident.

He set it up just like Leon Edwards set up that head kick on Kamaru.

There's a beauty of that that's just man, in the middle of chaos and anxiety and fear and the fucking fog of war, you figure out a way to connect with this thing that you saw in tape and in training and in preparation So it's with John.

It's not an accident that he's the goat even with his lack of training even with his even with the the kid it's just like he's so fucking talented that he almost needs another John Jones to make him compete the way he would, make him train the way a lot of these other guys do.

Like he's so good he can beat those guys without being challenged by someone like him.

Because John Jones has never faced a John Jones.


Speaker 0: The Joe Rogan experience. But I remember, and I think in my mind, is undeniably the GOAT, as again, a just above casual fan, Jon Jones.

Speaker 1: Jon Jones is the GOAT. He's the GOAT. Now, it's undeniable. It's undeniable. There was all this debate until he submitted Cirogan and became the heavyweight champion.

No 1 can fuck with that

Speaker 0: Smashed him bro And Cyril looked kind of unbeatable up until the Francis fight

Speaker 1: Well, the Francis fight exposed 1 aspect of his game that you're never gonna beat John in and that's the wrestling Yeah, and then everybody said well, he didn't know that Francis was gonna wrestle him given Francis is not the caliber wrestler or even in the realm of John Jones John Jones been wrestling since he was 12 years old. He took down Daniel Cormier who's an Olympic level wrestler Yeah, there is not a guy in the world that can say that You could start wrestling at 29 years old I mean I mean you'd have to be the freakiest of freak athletes to be able to compete with that guy to start wrestling when Cyril Gawn started wrestling. The gap is just too wide to cross.

Speaker 0: Right. So I think what I was thinking is, and when I bring up Jon Jones, is I remember... The first Jon Jones fight I watched was when he got DQ'd against Matt Hamill.

Speaker 1: Okay.

Speaker 0: From the 12 to 6 elbows. Yeah. Right? That was my first experience with him. The next thing I feel like I remember, and I may have seen some of his fights in between then, but is when he like beat up this guy that was like trying to rob this lady like the night of

Speaker 1: that was the day he fought for the title right he like a he fought for the title he chased down a guy who robbed someone And tackled him and held him until the cops came

Speaker 0: right

Speaker 1: and then and when I fought Shogun It became the youngest ever UFC champion.

Speaker 0: Yep, so here's what I'm getting at is I room and I and this is gonna be an just Kind of I'm interested in your take on this because I watched it happen with Jon Jones, and I feel like I watched it happen with Kamaru as well. Where it was like, Jon and Kamaru, as they came up, right? It's like, Jon does this thing where he stops this robber and he wins the belt. He beats Shogun, who is this kind of like... You know, him and Lyoto were these kind of like Unfigurable guys to me as a fan at that time, right like guys like how do you beat Lyoto Machida?

You can't forget you can't even touch the guy right at that time and they were like inherently these like good guys that everybody was rooting for

Speaker 1: and

Speaker 0: then both of them became these like epically long-reigned champions that then became sort of like villains.

Speaker 1: Kamaru was never a villain.

Speaker 0: I feel like he is.

Speaker 1: Really?

Speaker 0: How so? To me as a fan, again, who doesn't know anything, and maybe it's the, it comes back to maybe the celebrity, like, ego thing, like, to the camera as a fan. Again, I've never met the guy, he's probably great. But just as a cas watcher, I went from going, I'm rooting for this guy, to then it'd be like the way he talks about himself. And I feel like Jon Jones was the same way to me.

Is they became this like really like, and then John got in all this kind of like turmoil-y stuff.

Speaker 1: Well, I don't think you can compare the 2. And here's 2 reasons why. 1, have you ever seen Kamaru talk? Like, have you ever seen Kamaru on my podcast? He's 1 of the nicest, most down-to-earth, friendly, smiley, fun guys.

There's what you're seeing is Kamaru the destroyer

Speaker 0: the dog

Speaker 1: the dog is ready to go to war

Speaker 0: that's the

Speaker 1: difference and that's what I was trying to ask is like signaling to all the other people I'm going to smash you

Speaker 0: right and

Speaker 1: that's what he's signaling

Speaker 0: And that's what I think I was asking is like is that all just perceived by me or is that? Yeah, you know I mean, that's

Speaker 1: part of the fun of being a fan

Speaker 0: sure,

Speaker 1: you know deciding what you like and what you don't like and personalities that you root for and Personalities you root against and sometimes you root against a guy and he wins you over because he's so goddamn good You like I wanted that motherfucker to lose but he's the fucking greatest Yeah, John is very different than Kamau John is what I would describe, there's human beings that have different temperament and different minds and different mentality and a Ruthless competitive drive that's almost terrifying to the ordinary person. That's John Jones John Jones is a bad guy Who's trying to be a good guy? Right, but that got that guy if we were living a thousand years ago he would be on a horse with the biggest battle axe, waiting in the back, hacking heads off, and everybody would be running. And those people have always existed. These dominators have always existed.

But John is like a genuinely sensitive, intelligent guy who's trying to do the right thing, but he's a fucking conqueror He's a fucking conqueror. That's that's that's the thing that's inside of him that leads him to be the goat and without that You don't get there. You don't if you're you don't get that you don't get a Mike Tyson without that You don't get a Muhammad Ali without that. You don't get a Marvin Hagler without that You don't get a you don't get that that there's a thing inside Some People that is a driving force that allows them to overcome the greatest around them. It's a Michael Jordan It's a there's a there's a thing man

Speaker 0: Tom Brady

Speaker 1: and those motherfuckers are hated They're always hated for sure because you have to hate him because you can't beat him.

Speaker 0: It's the 260 inch deer dude Because my me and my buddies were talking. It's like there's not like they're like man. That's not the deer of a lifetime, that's the deer of 10 lifetimes.

Speaker 1: Yeah. Most people will never see that. Right. But it's even more than that because you can just accidentally stumble across the deer of a lifetime. You can't accidentally beat John Jones.

There's a there's a thing about...

Speaker 0: So he's goat over Khabib.

Speaker 1: He's goat over everybody now. Khabib's too? Yeah Khabib is in the conversation But Mighty Mouse is in that conversation to Mighty Mouse to me if you want to look at like a technical expression of the greatness Of martial arts he's as good as anybody's ever done it when when Mighty Mouse was the flyweight champion and the only problem is up besides So who do and a couple other guys like Benavides and he was not dealing with guys that are of the caliber Of the guys that John Jones was facing John Jones was facing Gustaf Guss have sent Glover to share He was facing Daniel Cormier He was facing the elite of the elite, and he never fucking lost, even when he was doing coke and he wasn't even training. That's how goddamn good Jon Jones is. And when Jon Jones talks about fights, though, when I had him on the podcast, 1 of the things that he talked about some people don't really watch tape or they only watch a little bit They let their coaches do the work John Jones studies everyone.

He studies their tendencies He's get it He gets in his mind how when you throw that Left kick you did you make this little step with your right foot You might do this thing when you shoot for a takedown when you keep your leg on You keep your head on 1 side every time you might do this thing Well when someone throws a right hand you always lean to The left you might do it and John Jones picked up that tendency and that's how he knocked out Daniel Cormier he knew Daniel Cormier has a tendency to duck towards his right side because he goes for that single on the left leg and John caught him with a perfect head kick But It wasn't by an accident. He fucking, he set that up. He set it up just like Leon Edwards set up that head kick on Kamaru. There's a beauty of that that's just man, in the middle of chaos and anxiety and fear and the fucking fog of war, you figure out a way to connect with this thing that you saw in tape and in training and in preparation So it's with John.

It's not an accident that he's the goat even with his lack of training even with his even with the the kid it's just like he's so fucking talented that he almost needs another John Jones to make him compete the way he would, make him train the way a lot of these other guys do. Like he's so good he can beat those guys without being challenged by someone like him. Because John Jones has never faced a John Jones.

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Joe Declares Jon Jones "The Goat" After Ciryl Gane Win